The Ultimate Goal of Life
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tittat
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What exactly is the point of life?
If you go for finding the real point of life,i am pretty sure that you may go crazy.Even the science cant really explain your question.
Why are we here? Where are we going?
We are here just for celebrating.Plan and save for tomorrow, but party tonight.
just my thoughts
If you go for finding the real point of life,i am pretty sure that you may go crazy.Even the science cant really explain your question.
Why are we here? Where are we going?
We are here just for celebrating.Plan and save for tomorrow, but party tonight.
just my thoughts
The purpose of life is to not know the purpose of life; you are given free will to determine how you will use this short time on Earth that you have -- for better or for worse. The actions you take and the way you treat the people and world around you will shape history in ways you will never know.
If we knew the purpose of life, we would no longer have that free will.
If we knew the purpose of life, we would no longer have that free will.
-What exactly is the point of life?
None, most likely.
-Why are we here? Where are we going?
No reason, nor is there any preset direction. Eventually, of course, there is a possibility that the human race will become extinct, by our own hand or otherwise, and another species will come into existence. That will probably repeat several times until the death of our star.
-What should we be doing, if anything at all?
Trying to help the human race in whatever way is possible, whether that's by doing scientific research, designing some electronics, educating the next generation of people, being a doctor, or anything that keeps society running along smoothly.
None, most likely.
-Why are we here? Where are we going?
No reason, nor is there any preset direction. Eventually, of course, there is a possibility that the human race will become extinct, by our own hand or otherwise, and another species will come into existence. That will probably repeat several times until the death of our star.
-What should we be doing, if anything at all?
Trying to help the human race in whatever way is possible, whether that's by doing scientific research, designing some electronics, educating the next generation of people, being a doctor, or anything that keeps society running along smoothly.
Well, like you said, people are going to jump on you for saying such, myself for one. Except i'm jumping on board with you. God is our ultimate purpose. He is our creator (thus how we got here), and for that alone he deserves to be eternally worshiped. Beyond that, he has given all of humanity a mind, the ability to think. Everyone is entitled to their individual positions, but I fear that many of you are in for a big surprise when the Day of Judgment comes.
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In reality there is no point to life. By no point I mean no over all goal to reach for. Maybe a set of personal goals but otherwise when we're born we aren't assigned a task that says "strive to this".
Some may want to believe there is an omnipresent being that oversee our lives and help guide us but I've always considered that not to be the case. People can live there lives and worship whatever they'd like though.
Anyhow, In many ways the way we came about is due to luck. Billions of years ago the earth had the luck of carrying the building blocks of life such as amino acids to create the first living thing. Those tiny cells living in the primordial pool eventually evolved into sea faring creatures. Eons later some of those creatures took to land and millions of years after that primates and the human species are born. We will continue to evolve too unless we face extinction.
Now what should we be doing? It depends on who you ask. I personally believe that living my life to the fullest is what I should be doing. Knowing that there is no afterlife makes me appreciate the time I have now more than anything. It's not like we are here for a long time...it's only a brief moment in the grand scheme of things.
Some may want to believe there is an omnipresent being that oversee our lives and help guide us but I've always considered that not to be the case. People can live there lives and worship whatever they'd like though.
Anyhow, In many ways the way we came about is due to luck. Billions of years ago the earth had the luck of carrying the building blocks of life such as amino acids to create the first living thing. Those tiny cells living in the primordial pool eventually evolved into sea faring creatures. Eons later some of those creatures took to land and millions of years after that primates and the human species are born. We will continue to evolve too unless we face extinction.
Now what should we be doing? It depends on who you ask. I personally believe that living my life to the fullest is what I should be doing. Knowing that there is no afterlife makes me appreciate the time I have now more than anything. It's not like we are here for a long time...it's only a brief moment in the grand scheme of things.
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All of us -- me, you, George Bush, my dog Cybele, the turtles that you like -- are all manifestations of Spirit. In reality, there's no me or you or dog or turtle: we're all just forms that Spirit takes. Spirit talking to Spirit, Spirit petting Spirit, Spirit murdering Itself over there in Gaza, right now... why does It do these things? I have no idea. In Hinduism we're taught that this is a some kind of Endless Play; I kinda like that idea.
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I totally agree. Thanks!
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First of all, there is no such thing as LUCK.
Secondly, How on earth did the earth ever carry the 'building blocks of life'? Amino acids need to come from somewhere. They don't just poof in to existence somehow. Of course, that's simple. Amino acids come from protiens. So where did the protiens come from?
Also, it is a SCIENTIFIC LAW, that life can NOT come from non living things. Just jumbling a bunch of protiens together in the right way will NEVER, not even in a million billion years, create any form of life what so ever.
And how, pray tell, can a microorganism evolve into a human? Where did it get all the DNA from? It definately didn't make it. The second law of thermo dynamics states that if left alone, things naturally fall into a state of decay. They become worse and worse, not better and better.
And besides, even IF we evolved from some amino acids, do you know how long it would take? Well, first of all, you need to know how many protiens are in a single amino acid. In the very simplest amino acid there are 22. In the more complex ones, there are HUNDREDS of protiens. For life to exist, all the amino acids are neccessary, but for my purposes, I'll stick with just the simplest amino acid.
So now, take that amino acid, and figure out how many amino acids you need to be able to make just 1 living cell. For the very simplest cell, 20 amino acids are required. Now, that is just the very simplest cell. The more complex ones, like the ones that make up humans, animals, plants, etc. have hundreds of amino acids.
But just taking that simplest cell, let's now take a look at:
'The 5 Steps To Making an Amino Acid!'
1) Assuming that there are 22 protiens to an amino acid, and 20 amino acids to a cell, that is 440 protiens.
2) Now, you do know that to make an amino acid, you can't just take any 22 protiens and put them in any order. They need to be 22 specific protiens in a specific order. Any other mix of protiens or any other order in which they link together, would not produce an amino acid.
3) So, first, you have to get all the right protiens, let's just assume that just the right protiens all happened to be togher, that will make it easier.
4) Then, all the protiens have to be in the right order. If those protiens all line up, then switch places to create a new order once each second, there are 1124000730000000000000 different possiblities, only one of which is the right one, it will take them 35,641,829,337,900 years. Let me put that into words for you: Thirty-five trillion, sixhundred and forty-one billion, eighthundred and twenty-nine million, threehundred and thirty-seven thousand, ninehundred years. You see then, for one cell to exist, it takes more time than you think that it ever took to create our world with almost an infinite amount of cells.
5) You also ontop of all that, need to keep nature from running its course, because a protien disintigrates within a minute of its creation if it doesn't bond into an amino acid within that time.
So, I just don't see how it is possible for us to have evolved from nothing.
You see, in the end, this all boils down to two points of belief. You believe that either
1) In the beginning, God created the heavens and the earth.
or
2) In the beginning, there was NOTHING, then it exploded.
I'm settling for the first of those two choices.
How about you?
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Protiens come from animo acids. Amino acids are in every living thing.
You want to talk about scientific law? Is that like the ten commandments? Have you ever heard of abiogenesis? Even if that hypothesis is wrong then I'm fine with that due to the fact that no one knows how exactly life began on earth. Religious people cling to god, aliens, whatever. Aheists cling to science or spaghetti monsters to understand it.
I never once stated they would. You're jumping to conclusions and assuming that I meant it.
They don't. You've missed the point entirely, probably deliberately.
Once again, you're missing the point entirely. You aren't proving anything. I'm not even going to read your wall of text. It's filled with unrelated crap that has zero relevance to the argument.
Obviously it's a lot easier to believe in a higher being that created everything. I too was told what to believe, but then I realized it was the silliest thing I've heard.
But the beauty about not believing in a higher power is that I do have more than two choices.
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Not quite right, Proteins are made up of Amino acids, which are just a certain group of organic chemicals, and it's quite probable that some simple chemical reactions could form these (I think they've managed to make amino acids with electric discharges through a mixture of gases thought to have been on the early earth) . Add a bit more heat and time, and you'll eventually get simple protein chains forming.
If you're thinking of Pasteur's work on spontaneous generation, that was about fully formed life forms (bacteria, rats etc.) coming to be because people in those days thought they just appeared out of thin air. However, science isn't even sure on how we got from proteins to life forms yet, but there are a few hypotheses (abiogenesis is one of them).
Gradual mutations, generation by generation over billions of years (i.e. evolution) has seemingly resulted in it.
Each time the organism reproduces (in this case, asexually by dividing), the DNA isn't copied exactly. Bits can be added, removed, or copied wrongly. If this mutation has resulted in something useful, like a protein which perhaps reacts slightly to light, then there's more chance of this cell surviving
The second law of thermodynamics states that if left alone in a closed system, things naturally fall into a state of decay. The Earth is definitely not a closed system, since it receives vast amounts of energy from the Sun.
Mixed up amino acids and proteins again, but I'll let that slip. It has taken about 3.8 billion years to get from single celled organisms to what we have today.
Actually, yes, you can in most cases. There's possibly over 10,000,000 proteins found in nature, so it's inevitable that you'll eventually get one forming out of chance
Not from nothing, no. Again, we don't know exactly how we got from proteins, but remember that it didn't just happen in a flash.
Don't forget that your religion isn't the only one with a creation story.
No. In the beginning, there was a singularity (an infinitely small and infinitely dense point of matter), and the natural state of a singularity is to expand outwards (rapidly). Where this matter has come from, we don't know.
Maybe it has always existed (after all, if different religions claim that their gods have existed for ever, it's not at all illogical to think the same for all the matter in the universe), expanding and contracting, forming a new universe on every cycle (albeit a long one). Maybe a higher being made it? Who knows. All we can do is analyse the data and create models and theories in a hope of better understanding the world around us.
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Oops, I guess I hadn't woken up all the way. Yes, Proteins are made up of a minimum of 22 amino acids, but most have hundreds.
Yes, they have managed to make amino acids, but there are two major problems with how they went about it:
1) First of all, they did not add oxygen to the mix of chemicals they used to make the amino acids, however, it is now general consensus among nearly all scientists that there was a LOT of oxygen in the early atmosphere. Any amount of oxygen, even just a little bit, would have prevented those amino acids from forming.
2) Secondly, assuming that those amino acids were able to form some how, do you remember how long I said it would take for them to form a single protein? And remember that those amino acids will also disintegrate within a minute after formation if it doesn't find a protein to join. So, there is a huge gap between the amino acids and the protein. I just don't see how random chance can jump that gap.
Except, mutations are ALWAYS for the degredation of DNA, nothing EVER gets better from a mutation. Mutations only cause the cell to lose some of their DNA
As I said before, scientists have observed THOUSANDS of mutations, and never once, have any of them added ANYTHING to the DNA.
Yes, but it is not enough for the earth to receive energy. The energy needs to be applied in a way that creates order. Other wise, if the energy is just 'coming in' you still have disorder. For example, a lightning strike is a lot of energy, if it hits a house, do all the windows become sparkling clean, the missing shingles on the roof nail themselves back into place, the crooked gutters staighten out, and the cracks in the foundation are all repaired? Of course NOT!
I have to disagree, but even if you could get just one to form out of chance over 3.8 billion years, well, there's 1. What about the other several thousands of different types of proteins? All of those are essential to create the world we have today.It has taken about 3.8 billion years to get from single celled organisms to what we have today.
Actually, yes, you can in most cases. There's possibly over 10,000,000 proteins found in nature, so it's inevitable that you'll eventually get one forming out of chance
So, where did that matter come from? It all has to come from somewhere. My hypothesis is that that matter came from a molecule of nothing that exploded into some matter.
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Really? Everywhere I read about early Earth they stated that the atmosphere was very different today. The atmosphere contained no oxygen and mainly consisted of hydrogen and helium. Cite your sources if it's the "general consensus".
Mutations aren't "bad" in the topic of evolution.
A molecule of nothing is still something.
Who didn't see this coming?
Well, let's just accept the facts:
1.) At the most basic, simplest level, anything is possible; our understanding of existence is limited to ideas that are strictly bound to methodologies (such as mathematics) that we as a species created to explain our observations about the world around us. 2+2=4 only because we say it does. It's important to note that we will always be limited in just what we CAN observe, and so everything -- EVERYTHING -- is speculation.
2.) The existence of God, or any higher power, can NEVER be proved OR disproved. There will always be a "higher", more esoteric, plane of understanding beyond our grasp against which faith can be applied, and rarely can it be excluded even when there are Theories and Laws to explain things in Cold Hard Science. This is human nature.
3.) Evolution, in its strictest definition, has never been proven and can never be tested. This is not to say it did not occur or that it isn't true; however, to test it would remove the spontaneous element that it requires to exist, and subject it to human error/persuasion. Because it can never be tested, it can never be a Theory (although it may remain a very supported hypothesis). (( And before anyone says anything, evolution != Darwinian natural selection. ))
[ It is for this reason that I personally get very upset when we try and force-feed it as a THEORY in schools; even as a Christian, I can appreciate the separation of church and state, but as a person of science and logic, it is crude and ignorant to expel any idea that competes with another, or to MARKET a popular idea as absolute fact. Science is about open minds and discovery, not crushing the competition through educational propaganda. ]
Well, let's just accept the facts:
1.) At the most basic, simplest level, anything is possible; our understanding of existence is limited to ideas that are strictly bound to methodologies (such as mathematics) that we as a species created to explain our observations about the world around us. 2+2=4 only because we say it does. It's important to note that we will always be limited in just what we CAN observe, and so everything -- EVERYTHING -- is speculation.
2.) The existence of God, or any higher power, can NEVER be proved OR disproved. There will always be a "higher", more esoteric, plane of understanding beyond our grasp against which faith can be applied, and rarely can it be excluded even when there are Theories and Laws to explain things in Cold Hard Science. This is human nature.
3.) Evolution, in its strictest definition, has never been proven and can never be tested. This is not to say it did not occur or that it isn't true; however, to test it would remove the spontaneous element that it requires to exist, and subject it to human error/persuasion. Because it can never be tested, it can never be a Theory (although it may remain a very supported hypothesis). (( And before anyone says anything, evolution != Darwinian natural selection. ))
[ It is for this reason that I personally get very upset when we try and force-feed it as a THEORY in schools; even as a Christian, I can appreciate the separation of church and state, but as a person of science and logic, it is crude and ignorant to expel any idea that competes with another, or to MARKET a popular idea as absolute fact. Science is about open minds and discovery, not crushing the competition through educational propaganda. ]
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http://www.huliq.com/36062/evidence-of-oxygen-in-earths-early-atmosphere
http://researchmag.asu.edu/2008/09/get_a_whiff_of_this.html
http://www.astrobiology.net/archives/2007/11/oxygen_in_earth_1.html
http://creationwiki.org/(Talk.Origins)_Earth's_early_atmosphere_had_abundant_oxygen
http://www.physorg.com/news80239957.html
http://astrobiology.nasa.gov/articles/oxygen-in-earths-early-atmosphere/
http://toarchive.org/indexcc/CB/CB035_1.html
Alright, here are 7 to start with. Notice that though they all differ on the amount of oxygen that there was, they all agree that there was some. And even just a very little bit is enough to keep the amino acids from forming.
That article seems total nonesense, unless I missed something, it doesn't seem to address the situation.
I was just joking. But seriously, where did that first molecule come from, it really had to of come from nothing. So you have nothing, it explodes, and you have something.
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It doesn't change the fact that earth's atmosphere before then did not have oxygen.
Let's take a look at an excerpt:
That means they have lived oxygen less for millions of years prior.
You said:
"Scientists have observed THOUSANDS of mutations, and never once, have any of them added ANYTHING to the DNA."
Which is wrong. Mutations are a primary part to evolution.
You're the only one who has said the world came from nothing. Cymro
had a pretty good idea.
Soki
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Better place huh?
I would have to disagree just like your "to war" contradicts your statement.
Nice point. :]
Again with the "to save human kind"?
It's like saying we need to help a dead animal.
Here is my reply on this:
Point? There was supposed to be a point?
Well, little child. Your mommy and your daddy decided to have [insert odd word here] and then you were born! :O
Well, I really don't know about you, but I am going to sleep now...
Well, we shouldn't be arguing over a nonsense, yet good subject. Anyways, I should be doing my 5-page essay due tomorrow, but I think that is about it. I don't know about you though.
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I don't agree with that. For example, Nylon eating bacteria is a quite good example of a beneficial mutation.
I know this isn't biology, but take crystals as an example. You apply a large amount of energy until the solution is melted, then allow it to cool down gradually. After a while, you'll get a bunch of crystals - if you look at these under an atomic microscope, you will see what looks like perfect order.
Chaos can become orderly very easily in chemistry.
You're right, it doesn't. Because those have got absolutely nothing to do with turning chemicals into ordered structures.
Lots formed
Why can't it have existed forever?
Before the big bang occured, you'd probably be looking at pure energy - not even subatomic particles, let alone complete molecules existed then.
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Bacteria had this DNA before they ever landed in this pool. You see, all it took was 1 bacterium with the proper DNA to get into that pool.
All the other bacteria could die off, but that one would have the neccessary DNA to survive. It will be able to reproduce at the rate of once ever 20 min. within a day, that pool will be swarming with hundreds of thousands of these bacteria. That's my theory on how these bacteria got there. Science has proved that that is the case with antibiotics (it was previously believed that bacteria evolved to become resistant to antibiotcs).
But that has nothing to do life. Those crystals are dead. They are not any closer to being alive than the beginning chemicles were.
All matter needs to have a beginning.
Pure energy? :hyper: Where did the energy come from?